General Performing a wedding ceremony

[Outcast]

I have seen a wedding ceremony in a strict sense when performed by a "minister." While I was still "ordained" by an institutional church, I was able to perform weddings in our state.

However, I would not do so if the couple were not "Christian." I considered that I would be asking God to be part of the threesome. I would not put myself in a situation where I would be joining unbelievers with God, supposedly.

My granddaughter was really upset when I told her I would not perform her wedding as she is an unbeliever. Now, for me, most churches are full of unbelievers.

I have resigned my ordination, so that is no longer an issue. I am asking you all how you see this issue. I am aware that there are many "ministers" who perform the ceremonies between couples whose only time in a church building is for the wedding.

 

[LeeB]

It is as they all say, “what GOD has joined together let not man put asunder.” No man can perform a marriage because only YAHWEH marries a man to a woman. There is no scripture that supports man made marriages. There is no description of the modern day marriage in scripture. The only participants in a marriage are the man, the woman and YAHWEH. Marriages in scripture were very different than today, you will never see a man of GOD perform a marriage in the old or new covenants and such a ceremony is never recorded. Today marriage has become a man made ceremony made up of bits and pieces of scripture relating to the topic but not the topic itself. Only YAHWEH makes a marriage covenant that is symbolic of the church as the bride of Christ which YAHWEH has also arranged. The stated love by both man and woman is acknowledge by YAHWEH and the sexual union is what then seals the covenant. If one commits adultery against another they do not answer to men but to YAHWEH. Just as neither husband or wife share themselves with anyone else but only with each other the church is so with Christ . Today YAHWEHS marriage is called common law and is frowned upon by the ignorant as next to adultery. Why do men think you need a license to be married? Can you get a license for love can you legislate love? People in the world will answer to YAHWEHS law, the 7th commandment but people who are YAHWEHS saints do not consider adultery or divorce the way the law did. Adultery was to be forgiven as with any sin and divorce only applied in cases of abandonment or attempts by one or the other to commit spiritual adultery.

 

[Outcast]

Yes, I realize that. I am referring to leading a ceremony that is used to acknowledge the commitment of two to be "as one."

I see the "church wedding" as having three persons be "as one."

For most, it is a legal device so that the couple has legal obligations and rights.

Then again, we still have a few states that prohibit a man and woman living as "husband and wife" without marriage. Cohabitation laws still exist, although it is rarely enforced. Other states, however, recognize "common law" marriage and even have legal protections for the couple.

My question is just one of performing weddings in the U.S. within a church as if God put the couple together.

In ancient Israel, it was quite a different thing.

I have a nephew and his "common law" wife of 14 years getting married today, and they know that I will not lead the ceremony. I think it would be a farce and sinful to pretend that this joining is 3 becoming one.

 

[LeeB]

Paul advises the saints to marry in the Lord, which means to marry a fellow Christian. Even in the church there was no man that performed marriages however there were celebrations of a marriage and unfortunately this is what we have today that people think is a marriage.
Your nephew is under the law even as common law or traditional marriage . The modern day marriage only serves to give control over to the false church and or the government. YAHWEH will recognize a marriage between a converted person and an unconverted person otherwise the offspring would be spiritually unclean. YAHWEHS elect today are so few in number that a marriage between two of them is highly unlikely. My wife Coni was unconverted when i married her but she was not antagonistic against my faith and attended fellowship with the brethren here and over time became converted. This is the conduct of the one being a witness to the other to win them over by YAHWEHS love seen in the brethren. When Coni and I were married afterwards I agreed to go through the false church thing only to legally make her my heir , wise as as serpent harmless as a dove thing. I have authority to baptize as does any of the elect but I have no authority to marry people.
Marriage was invented by YAHWEH and HE alone determines what is a marriage or not. To do this requires the ability to know the thoughts and intents of the heart which no human can do. Marriage has existed since Eden but the understanding of what it is remains with YAHWEH.

 

[LeeB]

It does not matter if a person is carnal or spiritual YAHWEH marries them and will hold each accountable in accordance to which covenant they are in. If YAHWEH did not recognize the marriages of the unconverted would HE have called Abraham who was a child of idol worshippers. Adam and Eve were both sinners but Able was called righteous. Mary the mother of Jesus was born under the law that makes no one righteous in YAHWEHS eyes but yet YAHWEH chose her to be the mother of HIS son. Both of my parents never were converted but yet through their marriage I was born. All humans are sinners with only one exception, Yeshua. Marriage for carnal people is like the law in that all who enter into the marriage covenant will answer for its violation as they will answer to violating the law. Converted saints answer also but not to the law of Moses but to the law of Christ, the law of love. YAHWEH said, be fruitful and multiply, but only in marriage. YAHWEH created man male and female that in marriage the human race would grow in number. I have seen married people who I know are unconverted but yet have a very good relationship and I have seen those who do not. It is a matter of love to be married and not for any other reason. Whatever anyone sows that will they reap and this applies to everything.

 

[Outcast]

It does not matter if a person is carnal or spiritual YAHWEH marries them and will hold each accountable in accordance to which covenant they are in. If YAHWEH did not recognize the marriages of the unconverted would HE have called Abraham who was a child of idol worshippers. Adam and Eve were both sinners but Able was called righteous. Mary the mother of Jesus was born under the law that makes no one righteous in YAHWEHS eyes but yet YAHWEH chose her to be the mother of HIS son. Both of my parents never were converted but yet through their marriage I was born. All humans are sinners with only one exception, Yeshua. Marriage for carnal people is like the law in that all who enter into the marriage covenant will answer for its violation as they will answer to violating the law. Converted saints answer also but not to the law of Moses but to the law of Christ, the law of love. YAHWEH said, be fruitful and multiply, but only in marriage. YAHWEH created man male and female that in marriage the human race would grow in number. I have seen married people who I know are unconverted but yet have a very good relationship and I have seen those who do not. It is a matter of love to be married and not for any other reason. Whatever anyone sows that will they reap and this applies to everything.

This line in BOLD font requires some thinking. I think that marriage is simply a lasting commitment between a man and a woman. We may question which version of "love" is involved, but there is evidence that the flexible one based on eros may have more impact in the marriage than agape - and ends at divorce. The seriousness of commitment I think is lost in the world around us.

That being said, I think there are two versions of marriage. There is the covenant version unto God and the legal version to the government. Government recognition is not required other than to formalize the agreement. It is much the reason why Moses required that the man issues a certificate of divorce when the man puts his wife out of the house. In the law for those at that time, a woman can be stoned to death if caught with another man while married, so she had to prove that she was no longer married.

While nobody else is contributing to this thread - perhaps it is too complicated - I think that the legal aspect of the wedding is for one purpose only - completed in the courthouse. The true marriage is recognized by God; which is the true covenant - no paperwork required.

Thanks for your contributions to the thread, brother. It has caused me to see things from a different viewpoint.

 

[LeeB]

I need not say anything else, you got it. You are correct that this is complicated as is the topic of government, voting and just who does appoint the rulers of this world. Finding the truth usually always involves connecting other truths together as all truth is connected together.