General Are We Born That Way ?

LeeB

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All of humanity has the sin of Adam on them from their mothers womb. This sin is the result of the knowledge of good and evil that has been passed down through generations. David said, in sin my mother conceived me. Psalm 51:5 David is speaking about this sin. When Adam acquired the knowledge of good and evil he lacked the ability to always do good and never do evil, of course this is impossible, David would sin and these sins would be his own. So when it comes to Adams sin we are all born that way but our own personal sins are ours alone. No one is a born murderer , rapist, thief, idol worshipper, adulterer or any other sin, we become sinners on our own with Satans help because we lust or covet in our human spirit to use our bodies to act out the lust in our spirit. We all have a defiled human spirit and we all sin in this manner. James 1:13-15 1 John 1:8 Even the saints with the Holy Spirit still sin that’s why we need grace. Unlike the sin of Adam our own sins are not somehow programmed into us by God. There are certain people who say they are born that way, this as shown is not true, they try to justify themselves by denying themselves by saying their sin is from Adam when it is theirs alone. Of all sins common to men no one sin is greater than another as all have the same punishment. The saints understand these things and willingly participate in the gospel message of repentance and asking forgiveness to keep their garments without spot or wrinkle. Lust is not of God, love is of God and love conquers lust. Whatever is not of Gods love is sin.
 
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Kaironaut

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Even if we were, is our defect the primary standard that we should use? By no means! The fruitfulness of God’s law/pattern is our standard. Shalom means that every thing must be in its proper place.
 

LeeB

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Even if we were, is our defect the primary standard that we should use? By no means! The fruitfulness of God’s law/pattern is our standard. Shalom means that every thing must be in its proper place.
May I ask what you experienced that enlightened you ?
 

Kaironaut

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My own pain, physical affliction and loneliness. To be fair, pain can either rouse, or kill desire. But considering how much I enjoyed stories from pop culture, and about human history, there has to be a common thread that unites them all. Since I can’t seem to be in the same wavelength as the others, I had to resort to my own private research. To be fair, people, both in and out of the church, were mostly too incompetent to answer my questions. There were a few who were most encouraging, even competent to go back and forth with me, but fate had to tear them away. Hence I am searching, mostly alone, stumbling upon books and YouTube videos about philosophy, evolution, natural theology, which eventually led me to Edward Feser, Lex Meyer, Ravi Zacharias, Rosaria Butterfield, Nancy Pearcy, Anthony Buzzard et al. After decades, I stumbled upon this forum by Lori.
 

LeeB

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I am glad you are here and I believe your input is valuable. Your story is similar to mine. I had to reach age 40 before my searching bore fruit. This site is an opportunity for all to learn if they have and open mind that craves understanding.
 

Kaironaut

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By the end of the day, the problem/puzzle of pain and perhaps joy, allowed me to search some more. To me, doubt is an invitation, a challenge from God. Perhaps a similar thing happened to C. S. Lewis. I know he harbored errors, but corrected much as he went through life. The realm of the forms as illustrated by Socrates, Plato, and Aristotle, is real - it just happens to be extra/sub/meta cosmic, namely our Father, Yahuah. The confluence of eternally related attributes necessarily and solely subsist together in one object - God or Omni-god as He’s named on YouTube. I know this is technical jargon but it comports/jibes with the biblical account(s), more than the others I’ve thus far seen. But of course, the Bible takes precedence. Would you rather hear about your Father, or hear from Him yourself?
 

Kaironaut

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Good Lord, does it really have to take that long? Some of my learnings could have been gained like a decade earlier. Perhaps, there is a reason we had to endure our own 40 years in the desert. If I recall correctly, God did prophesy a famine not of food or drink, but a famine of knowledge. The days are coming," declares the Sovereign LORD, "when I will send a famine through the land-- not a famine of food or a thirst for water, but a famine of hearing the words of the LORD. Men will stagger from sea to sea and wander from north to east, searching for the word of the LORD, but they will not find it. Amos 8:11.
 

LeeB

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Even as a youth I was driven by a desire to know and understand. When it came to religion I was like you, no one had any answers. I too did my own research and prayed for understanding. I did not trust men but I did trust God. God had mercy toward me and I experienced His love that continues to this day to inspire and edify me and those I fellowship with.
 

LeeB

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Even through famine God has called and chosen a people for Himself. The gates of the grave will not prevail over His church. At this present time there is a remnant according to grace. Unless God has this remnant the Earth would be as Sodom.
 

Kaironaut

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As of the ascension of Jesus, he owns both the Church and the Grave. Other parties(Satan, the wicked, etc.) may have attempted to control it, but they don’t have the title deed.